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+--- Thread: Ios Siri or Homekit support? (/showthread.php?tid=92)
RE: Ios Siri or Homekit support? - tss68nl - 06.11.2017
(30.10.2017, 07:12)edgars Wrote: yes, it is done. Please see separate thread on this subject here
Edgars, I don't understand. That is not Homekit integration, it's Siri integration
Have you all been working on Siri integration? It just doesn't make sense to me:
- It needs a separate app on your phone. The reason I actually use homekit, is that I don't need to unlock my phone, open an app, and thén run a command.
- Homekit is already integrated on your phone, even on lockscreen, home button ánd voice command. This is just an app?
- Homekit works from all over the world, as your appleTV automatically becomes a hub/server. Am I right this LM siri integration only works locally?
- You actually need to configure all the combinations of words / actions you can perform on an entity. Seems a few steps back, as the Homekit implementation of Siri already takes the names / types of your entities and there are already 20 different ways of turning on/off the same light without ever needing to mark one keyword.
Oh boy, did I tell a lot of clients that Homekit support is coming for LM since you advertised it.
RE: Ios Siri or Homekit support? - Daniel - 06.11.2017
Hi
I feel sorry to see that you disappointed of our Siri implementation, it was big effort and lots of time from us.
To be honest we started with homekit approach and even we had beta version implemented but we fount that if we will release such app we simply could end up i court as Apple could sue us. We as manufacture can't do it. Apple was requiring everybody to use security chip in every device, all other implementations are simply hacks. At that time we decided to use Siri API which is officially available and integrate voice control this way.
Recently Apple announced software only implementation but apart of the announcement nothing else was done. There is no info anywhere what and how to do. We also see that this will be allowed only for DIY products and not commercial.
I have to disagree with you that there is more work in configuration. Regardless which implementation we would do you will have to make object mapping and instead freely define your commands you will have to select them.
There is even more. You guys don't know it yet but we are just finished Andriod version of Logic Machine app and the same voice config app is used to configure google voice. This way you have to just configure one app and both platform are the same.
Thanks to this regardless of the platform user will have the same experience with the product.
And one more thing, Our voice app can work with any text communicator, as long it is able to send
http://ip/apps/voice/api/?a=command&cmd=TEXT
We will not promise anything else now as we need to wait what actually Apple means by software implementation.
On other hand if any of you would like to make homekit app with hack in it then you are free to do so but we are not taking such risk.
RE: Ios Siri or Homekit support? - gjniewenhuijse - 06.11.2017
(06.11.2017, 11:38)Daniel. Wrote: On other hand if any of you would like to make homekit app with hack in it then you are free to do so but we are not taking such risk.
If i run homebridge on a PI, i need to install/configure knxd or eibd to access the knx system. Is it maybe possible to connect to the eibd process on the lm/hl?
So i have the same gateway for all my knx devices, also for my homebridge/homekit.
In my config i enter:
"knxd_ip": "127.0.0.1",
"knxd_port": 6720,
RE: Ios Siri or Homekit support? - tss68nl - 07.11.2017
(06.11.2017, 11:38)Daniel. Wrote: I feel sorry to see that you disappointed of our Siri implementation, it was big effort and lots of time from us.
Hello Daniel,
I am not disappointed with your Siri integration, I am sure it works fine! I am disappointed that there is no Homekit integration.
The big downside of any 3rd party Siri integration is the fact that it lives in its own application. If I already need to unlock my phone, find the app, open the app, find the speech button and then issue a voice command.... I could just as well just press the function I want to change in an app right?
And using Apples integration of Siri (the only implementation not application bound), I can just say 'Hey Siri,....' and it works. No unlocking, no app, no button....
So it's not your Siri implementation, it's the limited possibilities that any 3rd party Siri application has: It won't ever beat the native Siri implementation of Apple.
The only thing that is needed, is Homekit support. If that is impossible, LM should have said so ... instead of claiming in KNX group advertising and LM site to already have it.
RE: Ios Siri or Homekit support? - gjniewenhuijse - 07.11.2017
I already pointed to this in the beginning. Also when i starts the beta testing, but never a reply to this point.
I think Siri support in an app is nice, but you got never the advantages of using the complete homekit integration:
- remote control
- ios home app
- ios logic
- handsfree, he siri
- etc etc.
RE: Ios Siri or Homekit support? - bmodeco - 07.11.2017
Hi all,
I agree with the remarks above but I also understand Daniel's feedback about developping a universal app/way for voicecontrol - this is a lot more efficient from a resource point of view.
I also agree with LM that as long as there is no software authentication (which is confirmed to become available on IOS and for commercial use!) there is no easy way to integrate it in the hardware - in the past apple required to use a specific chip for hardware authentication. Hopefully the software authentication becomes available rather soon...
However I do believe that future integration with homekit is mandatory for all home-automation systems. All new home-automationfriendly devices support homekit, even the Ikea-lights now support homekit though a software upgrade!
As I stated before I am using Thinka as a homekit module.
Once you are used to voice control through siri this is incredible powerfull. Just some advantages on top of what has been written already:
- easy geofencing: when arriving home at day/night you can easily trigger actions even with multiple people/iphones, last one that leaves the house automatically triggers the action
- control from apple watch, i am using this when walking through the house...
- the voice control or control through the home-app works from wherever you are in the world (very fast) and is secured over the internet without any vpn, port fowarding...it just requires an apple tv that is it.
- you can combine the rooms to a floor: so I can give a command to close all the blinds on one complete floor or in the complete house, same for lights and so on...very powerfull.
- scene creation can be easily done on the ipad/iphone in the app and these scenes can be activated through siri - very easy from a user point of view to add extra scenes or modify existing ones...
- supports all siri-languages: i am using my native dutch language to control the installation - so using english would also be a step back.
I have been using siri-control/homekit on my knx-installation for almost a year now and using an app with a button to activate voice control felt like a step back for me.
Nonetheless I find that the LM-developmentteam does an incredible job in adding new features and supporting its customers! Still love the Logic Machine!
Just fyi: another company (and have seen them demo it once in Germany and once in Belgium) have a KNXcontroller with built-in siri-support. They state on the website that it is not apple approved! But is has all the homekit/siri-functionality. Weblink: https://proknx.com/en/product/realknx-en/
They also state it is backwards compatible, don't know how they do that on existing hardware...
Keep up the good work!
Bart
RE: Ios Siri or Homekit support? - gjniewenhuijse - 07.11.2017
I never said openrb doesn't do a good job, i appreciate there good work!
But they missed the Homekit boat now
Last week i see a new product from xxter: pairot
https://www.xxter.com/pairot/
Its the only apple certified bridge between homekit and knx at the moment.
RE: Ios Siri or Homekit support? - Daniel - 07.11.2017
Hi
I fully understand the benefit of homekit and I agree with you on all points. I use Alexa at home and in did voice control is the most fancy switch now.
We need to wait till Apple will let us do it properly and then for sure we will take it on the table again.
If somebody would like to play with homebridge on LM then this library has to be rewritten from javascript. Similar way like Erwin did for the sonos app.
PS. Please don't forget about all other benefits from our iOS app. Push notifications works seamlessly trough the cloud anywhere you are in the world as we use Apple and Google services for that. Tutorial is on its way...
PS. I'm uploading Android version now.
BR
RE: Ios Siri or Homekit support? - Freddy - 07.11.2017
Alexa and HomeKit support are to be found in a separate module. I think Pairot is the first and only HomeKit certified knx bridge on the market now?
RE: Ios Siri or Homekit support? - Igor68 - 08.11.2017
Hi, Daniel, I could not find an application for Android in the Play Market. When will it be available?
RE: Ios Siri or Homekit support? - Daniel - 08.11.2017
(08.11.2017, 13:45)Igor68 Wrote: Hi, Daniel, I could not find an application for Android in the Play Market. When will it be available?
Hi
I started the process yesterday but Google require quite a lot of different info from us and it takes quite a bit of time. I hope to finish everything today.
I will drop info on the forum once is out. I'm dooing it for the first time
Sorry for the delay. BR
RE: Ios Siri or Homekit support? - Igor68 - 08.11.2017
Thanks, we're waiting))
RE: Ios Siri or Homekit support? - Daniel - 08.11.2017
Hi
Android app is out
We added a lot more languages to voice control. Not all were tested
If all will be ok we will add them to iOS app too. Here
BR
RE: Ios Siri or Homekit support? - Igor68 - 09.11.2017
Daniel, good work! On my device android application works even better than Siri)))
RE: Ios Siri or Homekit support? - thientiti01 - 30.11.2017
(23.07.2016, 13:44)bmodeco Wrote: I have bought the thinka to do this. It allows you to do on/off switching and dimming using knx objects for the moment and works great. On ios there are some homekit apps available that allow you to create scenes and so on. You need an knx-ip router (like LM) to use it.
Check out thinka.eu.
Hi,
Thinka can be intergrated with Homelynk. I want to use alexa to control KNX but i am using Homelynk. If ít can be, i should be buy what's something ?
RE: Ios Siri or Homekit support? - domotiqa - 19.04.2018
I'm not fan of your approach for voice control. Using separate App is a choice but not the best I think. Homekit approch is very cool. I'm using it on rasppi and homebridge and work great, even when cell phone is loked. You just push long time the home buton... no app to run... I can use the siri remote from appletv and mic inside it also...
I really think you should develop nativ homekit support
RE: Ios Siri or Homekit support? - Erwin van der Zwart - 19.04.2018
Development is not the problem, it’s the bar set by Apple. certifications, chips, logo’s and even the way you package your device is prescribed to be homekit certified.
Would you want to pay (a lot) extra for that for each controller you buy even when you don’t need voice control?
I guess Alexa and Google (and even Cortana) will win this race in the end..
Google Assist is comming to iOS..
BR,
Erwin
RE: Ios Siri or Homekit support? - domotiqa - 19.04.2018
maybe paid option in the store ?
or a hack like homebridge with mention experimental !
Siri will be forever here still apple exist ! But you're wrigth, amazon and google are also here and would be in lot more "middle" level house like they are doing in the usa (amazon echo as brain, and honeywell... all brand compatible in the house). Amazon is doing the support also.
RE: Ios Siri or Homekit support? - Erwin van der Zwart - 20.04.2018
Hi,
Packaging and logo's and certification is not done by app store ..
I don't think a hack is a option for a commercial company (:
BR,
Erwin
RE: Ios Siri or Homekit support? - domotiqa - 20.04.2018
(20.04.2018, 12:31)Erwin van der Zwart Wrote: Hi,
Packaging and logo's and certification is not done by app store ..
I don't think a hack is a option for a commercial company (:
BR,
Erwin
If you have a look to realknx or looks like its done its based on openhab and for sure soft like homebridge. It look like using product like eibd Isa not a hack for you but homebridge is
